TRAVELLER Digest 495

Topics covered in this issue include:

  1) Re: Drop Tanks -- the continuing saga by PPUGLIESE@pimacc.pima.edu
  2) 2300AD and FF&S by broussa@ConnectI.com (David C. Broussard)
  3) Re: Planetoid Hulls by merrick@Rt66.com (Merrick Burkhardt)
  4) planetoid towing... by merrick@Rt66.com (Merrick Burkhardt)
  5) Re: 2300<->FF&S by aswfh@orion.alaska.edu (William F. Hostman)
  6) Re: planetoid towing... by "David J. Golden" <goldendj@whip.com>
  7) Re: planetoid towing... by merrick@Rt66.com (Merrick Burkhardt)

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Date: Sat, 25 Nov 1995 06:03:58 -0700
From: PPUGLIESE@pimacc.pima.edu
To: traveller@MPGN.COM
Subject: Re: Drop Tanks -- the continuing saga
Message-ID: <01HY1SXX99768X1FCZ@pimacc.pima.edu>

From:IN%"traveller@MPGN.COM" 23-NOV-1995 20:54:14.90
To:IN%"traveller@MPGN.COM"  "Multiple recipients of list"
CC:
Subj:Drop Tanks -- the continuing saga

As I understand the rules, using drop tanks works like this:

1) The navigator computes a jump at the ship's *current*
displacement value (i.e., a 200-ton J-2 far trader w/ 50-ton drop tanks
now has J-1 capability)

2) After the navigator successfully computes the desired jump, the
engineer activates the jump drive

3) Upon activation, the jump drive begins to consume fuel (to
include fuel from the drop tanks) while charging the hull grid and/or jump
coils (whichever... :-)

4) At the critical energy threshold, the jump field forms about
the ship, and the ship exits our universe for a week

At no time once the jump process has been initiated can the ship safely
discard the drop tanks (without aborting the jump in progress).  Thus, the
ship *must* jump with the drop tanks.
Thanks.--  Franklin W. Cain
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

According to canon drop tanks can indeed be dropped before jumping to
avoid degrading jump capability. There are many instances where this
has been mentioned.

Phil

ppugliese@pimacc.pima.edu


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Date: Sat, 25 Nov 1995 09:36:30 -0600
From: broussa@ConnectI.com (David C. Broussard)
To: traveller@MPGN.COM
Subject: 2300AD and FF&S
Message-ID: <9511251536.AA18638@ConnectI.com>

I would set 2300AD at about 11 maybe 12.  Remember at the beginning they
talk about tech curves.  2300AD had some areas that are quite advanced, but
others that are lagging behind or just different than the TNE universe.  One
of the great things about stutterwarp ships in 2300Ad was that you didn't
have to have a  nuke reactor to run a slow ship.  I am not sure if mass is a
more realistic measure than displacement as you have to tunnel the ENTIRE
ship whether it is empty of full anyway.  I will try some numbers to clear
up the energy usage discreapancy.

One general question, does a MHD turbine require Oxygen to run if so
wouldn't a ship have to carry LOTS of O^2 to run its engines.  Just a
thought on non-nuclear drives in deep space...
David C. Broussard (broussa@connecti.com)
Home page: http://www.connecti.com/~broussa/
-----------------------------------------------------------------
The opinions represented herein are the sole responsibility of
the proclaimer, and should not be interpreted as dogma, doctrine
philosophy, or anything else other than blabber.  However, if you
REALLY like it, then gimme a dollar!
-----------------------------------------------------------------


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Date: Sat, 25 Nov 1995 10:16:16 -0700 (MST)
From: merrick@Rt66.com (Merrick Burkhardt)
To: traveller@MPGN.COM
Subject: Re: Planetoid Hulls
Message-ID: <9511251716.AA21229@Rt66.com>


> >Planetoid hulls are on our list of things to do in the gdw-beta list.
> >Stay Tuned!
>
> Feh!  Most of what you need for planetoid hulls is already in FF&S, hidden
> in the section on deep meson sites...
>
> James Kundert <j.kundert@genie.geis.com>

True, the tunneling costs are there, and everyone checks "Meson Guns"
when building a hull! ;-).  But the prices might vary from a mainworld
deep site, to a relatively shallow planetoid in a zero g (or microgravity,
to be more precise) environment.

The big trick (which isn't all that hard, actually) is coming up with
the toughness of a nickel-iron asteroid, then taking the towing costs,
etc. from CT/MT.  The only point of working this up on the beta list is
to have a consistant way of doing it (with as much untouched FFS as
possible).

My guess is that the toughness should be around 1 and the mass around 8.
I think someone on the beta list figured this out a while back when FFS
first came out.  I'll check the archives.

Then you calculate the internal structure volume and armor desired and
subtract from the total displacement.  It's pretty easy, actually, but it
would be nice to have it in a short, step by step format so you don't have
to jump to the Meson Gun chapter to design a hull :-)

Also, all the weapons will have to include armor, or be treated as
unarmored surface hits.  Still not hard at all, just a pain with FFS
(it'll be nice to have a standard set of assumptions as well so we can
use each others designs).

-Merrick

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Date: Sat, 25 Nov 1995 10:32:55 -0700 (MST)
From: merrick@Rt66.com (Merrick Burkhardt)
To: traveller@MPGN.COM (traveller)
Subject: planetoid towing...
Message-ID: <9511251732.AA22110@Rt66.com>


Another thing...

Towing a planetoid got a lot different with TNE.  Changing the orbit is
non-trivial now with fuel in short supply.  Belters will have an
interesting time as well finding the kinda rare (at least in the Sol
system) M type asteroid (nickel-iron) given fuel constraints. The
iron-magnesium silicate silicate types (S type) are more common.  C types
are the most common at about 75%, but carbonaceous ones might not make the
best hulls :-)

Actually the fuel use "problem" actually makes belt mining more
interesting to me (then again, I like the limits on fuel).

It's my bet that the tunneling costs might be similar to deep site
rules, but the cost of the total hull will have to do with its mass, and
it's orbit as found.

Guy in mining office:  "Well, we have just the right M-type for your
needs, but it's in a highly inclined orbit---this isn't gonna be cheap!"

-Merrick

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Date: Sat, 25 Nov 1995 14:10:19 -0900
From: aswfh@orion.alaska.edu (William F. Hostman)
To: traveller <traveller@MPGN.COM>
Subject: Re: 2300<->FF&S
Message-ID: <v01530500acdd517611a0@[137.229.100.54]>

I always saw 2300 as about TL 10-13, depending upon location. Aurora is
definitely about tl 10, and earth has cybertech, pushing it towards TL13.

I noticed differences in the two design sequences right off, as well. I am
interested to see the (currently conjectural) 2300 Adaptation to the TNE
rules.

Which brings me to another gripe: For a system that is so obviously
intended for multi-setting gaming, it sure is poorly set up. The basic TNE
book has too much background to be a core rules book for a multi-setting
system, and no tech data. FF&S is definitely filled with exotica that
should have waited for FF&S vol2 so that classic traveller bits could have
made it in.



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Date: Sat, 25 Nov 1995 23:37:55 -0700
From: "David J. Golden" <goldendj@whip.com>
To: traveller@MPGN.COM
Subject: Re: planetoid towing...
Message-ID: <199511260637.AA16427@ns-1.csn.net>

At 12:37 pm 11/25/95 -0500, you wrote:
>
>Another thing...
>
>Towing a planetoid got a lot different with TNE.  Changing the orbit is
>non-trivial now with fuel in short supply.  Belters will have an
>interesting time as well finding the kinda rare (at least in the Sol
>system) M type asteroid (nickel-iron) given fuel constraints. The
>iron-magnesium silicate silicate types (S type) are more common.  C types
>are the most common at about 75%, but carbonaceous ones might not make the
>best hulls :-)

        What about the classic SF mass-driver drive? Land on the chosen
planetoid and start tunneling right there, using the debris to fuel as mass
driver. You'll still not get anything approaching a G, but you'll have to
accept the slow transit.
 ___________________________________________________________________
  Dave Golden                              PGP Public Key available
  goldendj@whip.com        http://www2.csn.net/~goldendj/index.html

 "He that would make his own liberty secure must guard even his
  enemy from oppression; for if he violates this duty, he establishes
  a precedent that will reach to himself" -- Thomas Paine


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Date: Sun, 26 Nov 1995 00:01:29 -0700 (MST)
From: merrick@Rt66.com (Merrick Burkhardt)
To: traveller@MPGN.COM
Subject: Re: planetoid towing...
Message-ID: <9511260701.AA15417@Rt66.com>

> >Towing a planetoid got a lot different with TNE.  Changing the orbit is
>
>         What about the classic SF mass-driver drive? Land on the chosen
> planetoid and start tunneling right there, using the debris to fuel as mass
> driver. You'll still not get anything approaching a G, but you'll have to
> accept the slow transit.

That'd do the trick.  Since you have to mine the material to use as
reaction mass, the workers would still have to live on an attached ship
though, and the labor would be a major cost (I'd think), no?  Still, in
some cases this is a neat adventure seed:

Players are hired on as mining workers for asteroid hulls.  They ship
out in a converted merchant vessel, jump to the asteroid, and match
courses.  The MD needs to be set up, mining begins... now comes the
months of digging.  Maybe a seeker takes the miners for liberty trips in
cycles every few weeks 4 at a time.

Seed 1:  An accident (actually sabatoge) strands the miners on the rock, and
the next resupply is weeks away.  Accidents start taking the lives of
miners one after the other.  Virus?  A madman?  Perhaps the MD is slowly
bringing the rock towards not just an orbit near the main world, but
actually hitting the world itself! (a Virus controlled MD)  If the
mining was being done by a small operation, there might not *be* a
resuply ship, so the players (once they figure out what is going on)
have to prevent the disaster.

Seed 2:  The asteroid in question is part of a small swarm in a highly
eccentric and inclined orbit.  The Monitor hull being mined is pretty
large (8000+tons), and is surrounded (within several 10ths of a ls) by a
number of smaller rocks.  Most are useless, some have water ice useful
for fuel and life support.  Miners sometimes take a "cart" (a small open
craft with only a few gturns of fuel) and explore the other bodies
nearby.  Hijinks ensue, er, alien artifacts are found, maybe (hey, it's
late, folks :-)  This will only be useful until they start actually
moving the Monitor, then it leaves the other rocks behind...

Whatever you do, it's a reason for people to spend a lot of time in an
inhospitable place.

-Merrick

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End of TRAVELLER Digest 495
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